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027: How to Embrace an Unexpected Reality and Overcome Unmet Expectations

Many times, things in our life don’t go according to plan, whether it be in our businesses, with ourselves, or with our families. So how do we reconcile the life we expected with a reality that looks drastically different?

Debbie Reber, author, speaker, parenting activist, and founder of Tilt Parenting, specializes in helping parents with neurodivergent children adjust to the reality of having a child with unique needs, including reconciling expectations with their new reality. She joined BOSS Talk host La’Vista Jones to provide tips and best practices for moving forward in the face of unmet expectations, no matter what the situation.

Introducing Debbie Reber

La'Vista Jones 00:02

So welcome to another episode of BOSS Talk. I am your host, La'Vista Jones, and today I am joined by my guest, Debbie Reber. Debbie, welcome to the show.

Debbie Reber 00:12

Thank you. I love the name of your show. I already feel cooler.

La'Vista Jones 00:20

Thank you. Thank you so much.

So, before we get into the nitty gritty of what it is we're going to talk about today, I want to just kind of introduce our listeners to you. So, a little bit about Debbie. Debbie is a parenting activist, bestselling author, speaker, and the founder of Tilt Parenting, a website, podcast, and a resource for parents like her who are raising differently wired children. The Tilt Parenting Podcast has more than 4 million downloads. And Debbie's newest book that I have here is Differently Wired: A Parent's Guide to Raising an Atypical Child with Confidence and Hope is available for you to read and fully consume.

A little bit more about Debbie. In 2018 she spoke at TEDx Amsterdam, delivering a talk entitled “Why The Future Will Be Differently Wired.” Prior to launching Tilt, Debbie spent 15 years writing inspiring books for women and teens, including Doable Chill in Their Shoes, the real-deal series from the Chicken Soup for the Soul, Run for Your Life, and more than a dozen Blue's Clues books. So, that alone makes Debbie probably one of the Cubs’ most favorite guests that we have ever had on the show, because he loved Blue's Clues when he was little. I love it.

So, becoming a solopreneur Debbie worked in TV and video production, producing documentaries for UNICEF, working on Blue's Clues for Nickelodeon, and developing a series for Cartoon Network. She has a master's in media studies from the New School of Social Research and a bachelor's in communication from Penn State. In 2019, her husband and her 17-year-old relocated to Brooklyn, New York, after living in Amsterdam in the Netherlands for five years. So first of all, why in this moment, am I just realizing that you are a Nittany Lion?

La'Vista Jones 02:17

Are you a Nittany Lion?

La'Vista Jones 02:19

I am not. I am a Buckeye. So, when I meet other people that have any kind of other association with the Big Ten I'm like, ‘Oh my gosh.’ Right? Especially, like, being in Arizona and, like, that connection. And you know, like, I was just like, ‘Oh, wow, like, those whiteouts that happen in Beaver Stadium, those are intense. Like, we haven't gone to one in person, but it's just, like, whoa. Just seeing on TV is, like, wow,

Debbie Reber 02:47

That's a long, long time ago. Very few memories left from that time of my life.

La'Vista Jones 02:56

Yeah, well, you know, football, college football in particular, is very important in the Jones household. So, it's one of those things, when the fall schedule comes out, all that stuff is, like, the games are on the calendar. My husband is a huge University of Michigan football fan, which I don't really know how the two of us work in the fall, but we do. And it's just, like, girlfriends automatically know, like, on Saturday, I'm not coming to your anything, because there's football on here from, like, six o'clock in the morning until, like, six, seven o'clock at night.

Debbie Reber 03:26

So funny. I have to be honest. So, my parents went to Penn State. My uncle went to Penn State. My sister went to Penn State. I went to Penn State. But I am the one who does not watch football anymore. They all still do. But I somehow...I don't know if it was living abroad. I don't know what it was. But I hear about it for sure. I know when it's happening.

Boss as Being in Control

La'Vista Jones 03:48

Yes. So yeah, I might drop you, like, a note the next time they play each other this upcoming fall just like, ‘Hey, hey Lion.’ All right. So, um, one of the things that I ask every guest that comes on to the show – and I love that you say that you like the name of the show – is I ask them how they personally define being a boss, and I'd love to hear your take on that. What does being a boss mean to you, Debbie?

Debbie Reber 04:18

Wow, um, I don't know if I've given it a lot of thought, because I know culturally, like, boss lady, like, it's really become a term and in recent years, maybe the last decade. But for me, like, I think of it as just kind of running my own show. Like, you know, I've been self-employed now since 2003, so 19 years. And I've certainly worked in different corporate worlds prior to that. But really being able to be in control of all aspects of my work and owning that and being really good at it.

So, I think it's like, you know, when you're a writer, it's like, you have to have a good idea, you have to be a good writer, and you have to be able to execute. And I think the same for being a boss. You have to have good ideas, you have to have the discipline, and you have to just do the work. So that's how I would define it.

La'Vista Jones 05:17

I love that. I love all of that. Thank you for sharing.

And so, you may not know, though, “BOSS” in the name of the show actually is an acronym that stands for Battling Overwhelm with Systems and Self-Care. So, during each show, I get the pleasure of having candid conversations with my guests, like you, that are bosses that have faced and battled moments of overwhelm in their businesses and lives, specifically leveraging systems and practicing self-care. So, with that, Debbie, are you ready to share how you’re walking out your boss talk on the show?

Debbie Reber


Why Human Connection Is So Important When Things Don’t Go According to Plan

La'Vista Jones

Yay. So, I want to start with a brief story. So, the last time I saw you in person, I had shared that my family, we had just received an ADHD diagnosis for our young son. But what I don't think that I shared was that the six to nine months leading up to that, I studied psychology in college, so I know just enough to be a little dangerous, right. So, like, I kind of knew that this was coming. I think I would have been more surprised if they had said that he didn't have ADHD. But that six to nine months prior to actually receiving the diagnosis was actually kind of hell for, like, me and my family, just kind of dealing with some of, you know, the unique situations that, like, our son was trying to navigate, not really knowing what to do to support him, trying to figure out how to just do life, you know, this way, you know, as a family, and just all the difficulties that came with kind of keeping that secret, if you will, from like those that are close to us.

But I do remember that, as we got closer to him actually going to, like, get his assessment and then going through, like, those appointments and stuff like that, I felt like I had kind of hit a point where it's like, you know what, enough is enough. I need to share what's happening with us. Because I need people to support. Like, I need some help. I need some love. Like, I need something. And that's not going to happen if nobody knows what I'm dealing with. And so, when I shared that with our – we call them our cub-munity because we refer to our son as our cub – and when I shared that I really felt like this weight had been lifted from me.

And so, I want to, you know, go into, like, my first question for you is, in that story, I kind of, you know, share about the isolation, you know, that I was kind of keeping myself in and not sharing. Why do you think it's so important that when we're dealing with kind of unmet expectations and maybe some of the chaos that kind of goes on with that, why is it important to connect with other people?

Debbie Reber 08:07

I think what you just described is not unusual when you're raising a differently wired or neurodivergent child, and we can often default to feeling like we are failing in some way. We can just start to live out very unhealthy thoughts in our minds, you know, concern, stigma. What does this mean for my child's future? What are other people gonna think? What are other people going to think of me as a parent? Is this a real thing at all? You know, like, we can really just kind of get stuck in our own internal dialogue that really doesn't serve us and doesn't serve our family.

And so, when we can, you know...and I'm so glad you made that decision to give voice to your experience, which is your real experience, and there's nothing wrong with it. There's nothing wrong with having ADHD. There's nothing wrong. It is a neuro type. It's an experience. And so, when we can give voice to that, then, you know, we often find, oh, there's a lot of us out here. And as soon as we can hear someone else, you know, “Oh, I experienced this,” or you know, get validation from a friend or someone else, suddenly, that sense of isolation starts to go away. And it's only through that that we can start to then lean into this experience and be better able to show up for the child that we have. But until we do, we're kind of letting fear, I think, fear of all the unknowns or the stigma, the judgments, the looks, all that stuff, we're letting that kind of steer the ship, and I don't think we can parent from a place of strength when we're in that mindset.

La'Vista Jones 09:56

Yeah, that's so good. I know for me personally, right, like, the thing that you're talking about, like, you know, the fear of, you know, him being labeled the stigma of, like, all of that, was just like, oh, like, you know, if I tell somebody what's going on, then are they gonna look at him differently? Are they gonna look at us differently? Are they gonna treat us differently?

You know, and that weight that I was saying that, like, you know, I felt like was lifted, you know, it also came with, you know, a ton of support. Like, what do you need? You know, we're here for you. Tell us, you know, how we can support you, how we can support the family, how we can support the cub. Um, you know, having those conversations with his teacher, they were, like, super supportive. And it's just like, I feel like once I started having, like, those conversations, it was almost like, what was I so afraid of, right? Like, because so far, everybody has been very supportive and open to, like, okay, how do we navigate this together? What resources do we need?

And even with our conversation, right, when you were here a few months ago, like, it was like, ‘Okay, this is what we're dealing with.’ And you're like, “Okay, here's this book you should read. Here's, you know, some podcasts that you can listen to. Here's, like, a website that you could go and check out.” And it's just like, oh, okay, like, when I'm not in this by myself, I don't have to be afraid of what this truth really is, right? Like, you know, a friend of mine that is a psychologist, she was telling me, she's like, “You know, you got the diagnosis now.” She's like, “Whether you want it or not, like, now you've got to figure out what this new normal is like and put the resources in place and make sure that accommodations are there if he needs them or whatever the case may be.” Like, yeah, yeah. Okay. Like we can walk forward.

Breaking Down Taboos to Give Others a Voice

Debbie Reber 11:43

But I would, two things that came up for me. One is that I'm so grateful you got that response, and especially from school and things, and that's not always the case. Like, I'm sure there are people who are listening to this who did not get that positive reception from everyone. But even more the reason to share what's going on so that, you know, you do find the people. So that if you have unsupportive people, you have other people to turn to who can kind of hold your hand as you go through this process.

La'Vista Jones 12:15

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And it's interesting that you say that. I think a few weeks after, you know, talking to his teacher and his principal, I was getting a pedicure and just happened to hear the conversation that was happening next to me. And it was a mom and her friend, and she was just kind of talking about her frustration of dealing with the teacher. And, you know, they've tried to talk to the teacher and, like, “Hey, this is like what our son needs.” And the teacher is like, “Nope, they just need to deal with it. They need to adjust that.” And I was like, ‘Excuse me. Let me kind of, like, interject in this conversation.’ I'm like, ‘You know, even though I'm kind of new to figuring out and navigating this myself, like, that's not okay. And there are things that you can do, right, to advocate for your child and for yourself, right. Like, the way that this situation is unfolding is not okay.’

And I think it comes back to, like, you saying, like, you know, sharing your voice and telling that truth. That I think that the more, you know, conversations like this, just about things in general that, like, don't necessarily go according to plan or, like, these unmet expectations, or just stuff that's just hard that we're dealing with. Like, the more we talk about them, I think the more other people are like, “Oh yeah, like, that's the situation I'm dealing with. And I didn't know that this was a solution. I didn't know that this was a resource.” Or, “I didn't know how to talk about this.”

You know, like, in my book, like, I talk about my miscarriages. And you know, my husband, he's a pretty private person, especially in comparison to me. And so, he's always like, you know, “Why do you share so much about, like, these experiences and what has happened?” And I'm like, ‘Because for so many that I'm connected to personally, like, I'm the voice for not only my experience, but for theirs because they don't feel like they can say anything.’

Debbie Reber 14:02

Yeah, yeah. So interesting you say that. I was listening to a podcast ­­– I don't remember what podcast – but the person had shared that they were pregnant pretty early on and had also experienced miscarriages in the past. And the conversation was there is such know, you shouldn't tell people until a certain time. And this person was like, “But why? If I'm gonna go through a miscarriage, I want everybody to know, because I need all of that support.” And I think, you know, it's really complicated, I think, with the breaking down these, these taboo subjects and, you know, surrounding mental health. Like, I feel like there, in the past five years, there's just more and more awareness and openness and willingness to talk openly about mental health challenges and neurodivergence. But it takes brave people to share their experiences in order to give other people permission to feel safe enough to do the same.

Bridging the Gap Between Expectation and Reality

La'Vista Jones 15:00

Yeah, exactly, exactly. And I know that was my experience. You know, the first miscarriage that we had, it totally, you know, blindsided me, came out of, like, nowhere. And so, then when we got pregnant again, you know, my husband's like, “Oh, you know, we shouldn't say anything. Like, nobody should know.” And I'm like, ‘Oh, but they have to.” Right? Because it's, like, I've already gone through, like, having a wonderful pregnancy with my son, you know, now having lost this, you know, other pregnancy. And it's just, like, just knowing the mental anguish, right, that I went through, and it's just, like, I not only want people to celebrate and share in the joy that I'm feeling right now; I also need them to know I'm kind of scared out of my effing mind about what could happen. And unfortunately, it did happen again. And it's just, like, I needed everybody around me. And I felt like not sharing that, not being honest, not being open, not actually, you know, sharing my truth wouldn't have been, like, authentic to me, and it would have been like I was hiding from what that reality was.

So, you know, as wives, as moms, as business owners, you know, we've talked that, you know, reality doesn't always meet what our expectations are. So, I have a two part with this. Like, how do we adjust to our new normal, where it's like, okay, this is what I thought this was going to be, right. And not necessarily, like, parenting, as, you know, in general, but this is just what I expected this to be. But this is what it is. How do we go about adjusting to our new normal, kind of accepting that and making that adjustment?

And then I guess the second part is, how do we let go of those shoulds, right? You know, like, even, like, our own internal kind of conversation that we're having with ourselves: ‘Well, this is how this should have been, and this is how I should have done this, or this is how this should have, you know, been the outcome.’ How do we start to let go of some of that as well?

Debbie Reber 17:02

Yeah, great question. And unfortunately, I always say, ‘Well, just do this.’ And it's like flipping a switch. And that is not the case. And, as I'm sure that you know, I think the most important part of it is to start to recognize where we are arguing with reality. And there's a quote from Byron, Katie, that I included in the book where she says, “When you argue with reality, you lose, but only 100% of the time.” And I love that quote so much, because that's how we often are, especially when we are clinging on to this picture we had of what our kid's life would look like, or our lives as parents, or our family, and how, you know, family events would flow. And, you know, and we're reminded, I think, regularly through mainstream media and shows and movies about whether it’s quote unquote to use the “should” word, what it should look like. And so, we can often be, you know, just, ‘Well, no, that's what I want. And I'm not going to accept what's actually happening here.’

And so, our first job is to recognize that tension and to identify it and really hone in on the ways in which we are arguing with reality. And it is when we're using words like “should” or “have to” or “needs” – like, you know, my kid needs to be able to tie their shoes by now. My child needs to be able to or has to be able to get out the door on time. Like, they’re X number of years old. They have to do this. And so, any time we notice that we're even using this kind of absolute language, that is an indicator that we might be arguing with reality. Because the reality is our child isn't tying their shoes yet, or it is taking us 40 minutes to get out the door, or you know, whatever the case may be. And so our job is to first notice where that tension is. And then we just have to do the fun work, and we get lots of opportunities, to practice over and over and over again but to reframe that. Okay, right.

And there's lots of different ways to do that. But it might just be, like, we're working on this. My child is working on tying their shoes. That isn't where they are right now. Or, you know, we can kind of change the thoughts, consciously change the thoughts that are kind of making us feel like we're stuck and that things aren't working.

You know, I recommend people write down the beliefs that they are holding on to that are causing a lot of pain and anguish for them. Because I think most of the pain in this experience comes from the thoughts that we have about what it all means. And until we really uncover those thoughts and give them a voice, we can't do the work then of dismantling them and of coming up with evidence to disprove them. And so, you know, I talk about just writing like your greatest hits list of, like, unhelpful thinking or greatest fears about your child and their potential and then start to look for evidence, start to dispute those thoughts, reframe them, come up with a different way to look at it. And we get, like I said, we get to do work on that every single day. There'll be plenty of opportunities.

La'Vista Jones 20:23

Yes, I have to tell you, like, even if nobody else listens to the show – which I know is not going to happen – like, that alone, has just kind of bathed, like, my mother's heart in just peace, right? Just like, yeah, like, that is something that I can do. Like, I can do that. Because like you said, like, this is something that's, like, it's an every day. Like, I live it every day. He lives it every day. And it's just like, okay, yeah, we can do this. This is not looking the way that I thought it should, right, the way that society tells us that it's supposed to look. But it's like, this is still my reality. This is it.

Debbie Reber 21:06

And there are so many...I mean, this could be a whole other conversation. But there's so many...first of all, there's so much freedom in throwing out the rulebook or in kind of getting off the path we thought we were going to be on. Because a lot of parents, families are on autopilot, right? They're just doing their thing. And which is, you know, not like...autopilot is less work, because you don't have to think as much, right? You can just, like, my child's going to this camp or into this school, you know, and they'll go to this middle school. And it just, it doesn't have to be as necessarily challenging at every turn. You have to consider every decision. Like, it has so much weight.

But once we realize, oh, this can look so much different than I expected, there's a huge freedom in that, and excitement, and an opportunity to get curious and experiment. And what you might learn through parenting this child or create as a family together could enrich in your lives so much, because these kids are fascinating. Neurodivergent humans, kids with ADHD, oh, my god. Like, they are so fascinating. They're curious. They're creative. They are nonconformist in the, you know, can be frustrating, but I think, ultimately, in the best of ways. But it's...again, it takes a while to get to the point where you can really, like, fully embrace all of that. But the key to that is to start just questioning not only the way we thought it was going to look, but you know, that there's one way to do this or there's one way to learn or be educated or to live a life. You know, we have to kind of dismantle all of that.

Relentless Self-Care

La'Vista Jones 22:53

Yeah, absolutely. I love that. I really, really do. So, when we're facing these moments, right, of kind of like, you know, unmet expectations, talk to us about this idea of relentless self-care. So, I know that this is something that you wrote about directly in the book itself. What does that mean? And how do we do it?

Debbie Reber 23:13

Yeah, I mean, to use the way overused metaphor, the whole oxygen mask thing, right? Like, you have to put on your own oxygen mask first. But with kids who are in some way neurodivergent, who are pushing a little more, who require or are more demanding of us, it is not an optional kind of a thing. There's no way that we can show up for our kids in the way that they deserve and in a way that is respectful and that takes care of their emotional needs, our emotional needs unless we are prioritizing ourselves. We will get burned out. We will be tapped out. We will not be able to parent from a place of strength. And our kids, especially neurodivergent kids, are so, like, tuned in to our energy. And so, and then we're not modeling. Like, there's so many reasons to do this.

So, I will just say it is not optional. It has to happen. And so, you know, I define self-care as something that is intentional and something that you do just for you. So I don't define self-care as, you know, going – although I would like to go to Miraval for a week – that is not, you know...and that would be self-care. But really, self-care for me would be, you know, listening to The Greatest Showman while I'm cooking dinner, right? Like, it's stuff you can incorporate and you're probably already doing. Like, people listening, you're probably already doing this.

But there's the intentionality piece that I think makes the difference. Because you're reminding yourself: I deserve this, I matter, and this is just for me. And even if it's a three-minute song while you're in the shower, those things add up. Those things matter. And they also show our kids, “Hey, you matter.” You know, “You taking care of yourself matters.” And as humans, we need to value ourselves. So, it is just something we have to commit to doing. We have to intentionally...I call it conscious self-maintenance now, or conscious maintenance. We have to consciously prioritize it and do whatever we can to make sure that we're fitting it in every single day, even if it's just little incremental moments.

Consciously and Continuously Building the Habit of Self-Care

La'Vista Jones 25:40

Yeah, you know, and one of the things I love that you said was, you know, it has to be intentional, right? And then you were saying that, you know, you're probably already doing it. And I think that one of the things that I talk about a lot is acknowledging it, right. Because I think that so many of the times, like, we see self-care modeled in a certain kind of way. And it's like, okay, self-care has to be like this kind of, like, the conversation we've been having, like, it should be this, and it should be that. And we don't actually figure out what self-care actually means for us on a personal level and see how we're actually already doing some of those things, like, every single day to acknowledge it and celebrate that, like, I took care of myself by doing this. And I took care of myself by doing that. And this thing that I do, it brings me joy.

And then it's, like, putting that intentionality behind it to do it on a regular basis, every day, like as often as you can so that you're filling yourself up and taking care of yourself. Because if it doesn't look the way that, like, my neighbor does it or that my best friend does it or, like, the way that this, you know, person does it, it's like, ‘Oh, I must not be doing self-care right.” And it's like, you probably are doing lots of little things that you're not even acknowledging are taking care of yourself.

Or, like, we focus on, like, the big things. Like, you were talking about your trip. Like, I love trips like that. Or going to the spa, you know, and doing like, I'm gonna just sit in a robe all day and have people rub on me and, like, you know, like, this is going to be amazing. I don't know about you, but I don't have the cash flow to sit at a spa every day for eight hours every day. I would love to. Maybe. I don't know, like, I don't think I would get anything done. But that's not a realistic self-care thing for me to do on a daily basis. But taking lunch every day and, like, sitting down and enjoying food, taking the break. One of the things I talk about is, like, I have, like, these, beautiful hand-painted wine glasses that a friend gave me. Like, I'll put lemonade in one of those and use it just during lunch just because they make me happy to use this really pretty glass. And it's, like, those are those little things that, with intentionality, you're doing it every day on a conscious level and you're acknowledging and celebrating it. Like, that's what builds, I think, a solid and sustainable self-care practice for yourself as an individual.

Debbie Reber 28:04

Yeah, yeah. One of the things I did when I realized I was completely neglecting myself – probably when Ash was maybe five or six – was, I made a chart of all...I like charts. Just sayin’, you know. I made a chart of the things that I saw self-care. I think at the time, it was, like, listening to songs from Rent, which was my favorite musical, listening to songs from Rent, going for a run, taking a nap, taking a 10-minute shower, like, whatever it was. And so, I made this chart, and I printed it out, and I had it on my desk. And so, I had challenged myself that every day, I had to do two items. And so, when I would visually see it there sometimes after dinner, I'd sit down at my desk and be like, ‘Oh crap, I didn't do anything.’ And then I'd be like, ‘Okay, it's time to listen to a song from Rent.’

So, I had to really consciously build the habit and then keep growing that list of things. Like, for me, like, watching one challenge on The Great British Bake Off while eating lunch makes me so happy. And I'll just say that just this morning, so, you know my 17-year-old has been going through a rough time, and you know, and they're also really listening to Rick Astley right now for some reason. I don't know why. But I'm talking Rick Astley from the 80s or 90s, whenever that was. But they discovered, like, a song that is, I think, didn't come out as a single, and it's quite a happy, like, groovy song. And so, last night I was like, ‘So, when are you going to, like, listen to that song in your morning routine? Because just that song can, like, lift your mood right away.’ So, they listened to it whilst eating breakfast and said that it helped a little bit. So, this is good stuff to be teaching our kids to do, too.

La'Vista Jones 29:55

Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. And I love, right, that when you recognize, like, hey, I'm kind of working from a self-care deficiency here. Let me figure out, like, these are things that are going to work for me.

One of the things that I try to incorporate, like, when I'm working with clients, is having them do a spa day. And I know I just talked about, like, you can't go to the spa every day. But it's another acronym. I, you know, you said you like tables; I like acronyms, apparently. And so the S is doing something smart, right, to like, stimulate your brain, whatever that is. Reading a book, maybe you're practicing a couple of words in Italian, like whatever. The P is doing something physical. So, if it's taking a walk, going outside, and just, like, putting your feet in the grass, like, whatever that could be for you. And then the A is doing something affirming. And so, it's like, if you're struggling with, you know, having a solid self-care practice, or you don't really know what to do, it's just, like, that's a simple way for you to kind of get it in every single day. And it's like, okay, did I do something smart? Did I do something physical? Did I do something affirming? Until those things kind of start to be part of just your normal routine. And it's just how you take care and how you treat yourself.

Debbie Reber 31:06

I love that. I love the acronyms. I'm not good at making them, but I appreciate a good acronym. Yeah.

Moving Forward in a New Reality

La'Vista Jones 31:12

Thank you.

Thank you. So, as we get ready to close, right, so, for the person that is listening, and you know, they might be dealing with unmet expectations in their life, in their business, with their family, what's, like, a parting advice, I guess, that you would give them to, you know, let go of what others may be thinking about them, you know, embracing their own truth, and continue walking forward? What are some last words that you would give them?

Debbie Reber 31:41

Well, I would say that when I was, you know...when my child was younger, and I was trying to run my business and dealing with all that was happening with school, breakups, and therapists, and all of that stuff, I was, I was fighting it. I really wasn't...I wanted my staff to be my staff. I felt like this was a huge inconvenience to my work, and all of my personal passions, and things like that. And I think I didn't realize how, if I leaned in and could, you know...not everyone has to integrate everything that they're doing. But you know, that fight, that resistance to accepting what was happening, hurt me in all areas of my life.

And so, if you're kind of in that tension, I would say to really make it an intention to lean in to who your child is, to get out of fix-it mode, which I think a lot of parents default to when they find out something is going on. They want to solution. They want to be able to get back on the path that they wanted to be on. You know, get back in control. And I think we waste a lot of time trying to control and fix things. So, if you can kind of try to shift your lens, look at your kid through a strengths-based lens and really focus on leaning in and thinking about how can I show up for myself and show up for who this human is, instead of kind of fighting what's actually going on. That would be my biggest piece of advice.

La'Vista Jones 33:20

That's beautiful. Thank you. So, Debbie, thank you so much for being my guest today and just kind of sharing so openly with the things that we've talked about. But before we sign off, how can those that are listening to our conversation today, how can they connect with you or at least follow you and just kind of, you know, be more connected with the work that you're doing?

Debbie Reber 33:40

Yeah, the best place to reach me is through And that is just full of resources. All almost 300 of my podcasts are on there. You can search by theme or by playlist on there. And there's also a pretty vibrant community on Facebook called Tilt Together. And those are good places to start. And yeah, I would love to see folks there reach out to me. And thank you, La’Vista, for having this conversation with me. And I love talking about this stuff, and I appreciate it so much.

La'Vista Jones 34:15

I appreciate you being here. This was a good conversation. Like I said, it did my heart good today. So, you know, even if this was a conversation for an audience of one – which I know it won't be – it was very impactful and helpful. So, thank you again for agreeing to give me some time and kind of talk me through some of the things that we talked about today.

And so, those of you that are listening, make sure to check out the show notes for the tips and resources that were mentioned during today's show. And I'm confident that something that was discussed today has resonated with you and is challenging you to make a shift to do what you love without sacrificing yourself to do it, especially by practicing that relentless self-care. So, until next time, be sure to subscribe to the show and continue to Battle your Overwhelm with Systems and Self-care and walk out your BOSS Talk.


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